You Don't Need Headshots, You Need a Brand Photoshoot That Helps You Sell with Ashley Ice
Ashley Ice is the brand photographer behind all the beautiful new photos on my website and I’m so excited to have her on the show. She shares how to get photos you are obsessed with, the difference between headshots and a brand photoshoot; we talk about how she works with her clients, what makes her process different, the 3 things you need to be ready for your own brand photoshoot and much more. If you need to update your photos, you’re thinking of refreshing your images for your marketing or website, this is the episode for you.
LIsten now
Before we dive into the episode, have we met?
I’m RuthAnn, the brand + Squarespace website designer behind the women-centered design studio, Rebrand with RuthAnn.
Since 2016 I’ve been working with incredible women coaches and service providers with sophisticated branding and website design. I LOVE seeing women step into their next level of business growth with a brand and website that’s set up for their expansion.
On the personal side, I’m a wife, mama to 3 littles and we live in Kansas City, Missouri. So good to meet you!
How did you get into photography, brand photography specifically?
Ashley: Yes, so I actually attended Fort Hay State University for graphic design, crazy enough. And day one, I realized that it's not what I wanted to do. I enjoyed my photography class a lot more, which made a lot of sense because I always wanted a camera since I was 13. I was always taking pictures of my sisters, my friends. I just never knew it could be like a job. I don't know, I college is where I was like, hey, this can actually be a thing because I went to Fort Hayes for fine art, which means you have to take all the different types of arts. Like even if you don't want to do painting, you got to take painting to figure it out because maybe you do like it. So thank you for Hayes for that one. Make me take photography because I really didn't want to because like film that sounds so scary because it's like you got to develop it yourself. But so glad I did. And then I actually want to work for National Geographic. I want to travel the world, see things.
And then I got into weddings on pure accident, I accepted a job for 14 hours of coverage for $300 with a $200 tip at the end of the day. And I fell in love because I realized that on wedding days, mind you, I've really never been to a wedding, especially this one was really nice. I had no business shooting this wedding to be very honest. I just fell in love with it because nobody knows what to do, even though there's a timeline and people need and assist like people to do things for them. But I didn't want to be the planner. So didn't want to like clean up afterwards. I didn't want all the communication with the vendors and just dealing with additional people.
So I loved wedding photography and I pursued that when I moved to Kansas City almost 10 years ago. That's when I really pursued the wedding photography side. And again, great weddings, had fun with it. And about three, maybe four years ago now, I was actually on a free webinar and the person who was hosting it was doing like free audits real quick. And she went over to my Instagram page and she noticed all my lay flats. So those are like shoes with perfumes and bales. And she noticed specifically there was these pair of shoes that were pearl. I also styled them on top of the actual box that they came in, a Bella Bella shoe. And she's like, “Did you do this for like the company?” And I was like, no, I did it for my client. She's like, this could be a branding shoot for this like company, like for their shoes. Like I could see this company because she also knows it because it's very popular wedding shoes to use it in their marketing. And I was like, she's like, you should really think about doing that. She like was going through more lay flats because I used to post this a lot on my page. It was like my selling point. Sadly, that is not selling points in wedding industry anymore. And I researched it and then 2023 I actually met a brand designer, did her shoot in Paris and she also encouraged me to get into the branding side. She's like, you don't understand how much you understand photo shoots and most photographers don't. Like it has to be that wedding background. Like being involved and needing to know what to do. So that's what happened and I fell in love with it because I realized…
It's such a controlled environment and nothing can go wrong. So wedding days, the bride will have beautiful inspo, would love to do it all, but there's too many people and it's a real day, irrelevant and real emotions. So I've had wedding days go completely off the handle. Yes, I still got a beautiful gallery, but maybe only like 10 % of their actual inspo they wanted to use could be used because they were so far behind from things that were out of my control. So that's how I got into brand photography.
Long story.
Sometimes the best entrepreneurs ‘fall into it’. I also have a wedding photography background and it comes in handy with branding! So I’ve had clients say they’re getting brand photos and then they end up with a bunch of headshots. In your opinion, what is the difference between headshots and a brand photoshoot?
Ashley: Yes, so this is something that I feel like over 50 % of my inquiries are requesting and then not understanding the differences of it and why there's such a wide price increase because headshots are like a quick 10 minutes, at least they're supposed to be quick 10 minutes, get some updated pictures of yourself. These are usually used like yearly doctors, lawyers, things like that.
And then a brand photo shoot, how I explain to people is just because you are your brand, your brand does something very specific and we need to get stock images for that. Yes, you can be in them, even if it's just your hands or if it's your feet and shoes, like whatever it is, but you need stock images. And I always say about 25 % really need to be your face and the rest of it needs to be you working or doing the thing that attracts your ideal client, what you actually do and what's gonna make sense to your brand. So that's how I explain it to clients.
And I also show them like Pinterest boards, like, hey, like this is just headshots. Like we won't be getting any stock images. This is what you need. And usually last year, it depends on how you post and what you're using it for, anywhere from three to six months for social media website, a few years, unless you completely change your ideal client. And that's when people are like, oh, well, I've always been just been getting headshots for an hour or two. And I'm like, yeah, that's not what you mean. That's why you keep getting more headshots and more branding sessions a few times a year. And they're like, I've been wasting my money. I'm like, sadly you have, but it's okay.
“I always say about 25 % really need to be your face and the rest of it needs to be you working or doing the thing that attracts your ideal client, what you actually do and what's gonna make sense to your brand.”
So when I've done brand photo shoots before I've normally just sent over an inspiration board for the photographer and then that's pretty much it and then I don't really hear from them they don't really hear from me unless I have a question until the day of our shoot and then we like do the shoot we kind of talk through some things but with you when we were together.
I was very surprised the level of detail you went into we had two meetings before the shoot So tell me your process, why you include those calls and how does that impact the result of the photo shoot?
Ashley: Yes, so the reason why I do the calls is because going back into my wedding background, I can do a lot in a small amount of time, which is really rare for photographers to be honest, even in wedding world, but
high stakes photo shoots, citizens, weddings. Can't redo that unless you really want to spend hundreds of thousand dollars again. I realize how much I can do within like 30 minutes, an hour, things like that. How I've been doing it for 15 years. Like I know how long it takes me. So I like to have those meetings because one, we got to get real expectations set up. Like if you, most people buy at least two hours to start with. But then when we go to do the first meeting, the ideas they've also put together is like an eight hour shoot. And so I have to go like, Whoa, like, come back to me, unless you want to add six hours love it, great, we can do that. But let's like reel it in, like, what do we need to do? So I also make sure that stays within people's budget as well. And they always have the option like, hey, if you really want to do this idea, you have to add that hour. Like if you really want to do that idea, we have to get a model.
So that's what helps people know exactly what they can do for their branding shoe. And every single meeting is completely different because we have the console and then that console is like 20 ish minutes. I get them to understand like what they need, what I can do. I make a quick inspo board literally right there on the spot. They're like, wow. You like already know. I'm like, I know that's like the beauty of my fine art background to be honest. And then the meetings help to make sure what they have purchased and going to make sure like that can happen. And then I started giving them homework to do. like for you, was like, hey, a lot of your inspo has like these papers, like on the wall or on a desk, we got to get them printed, like, and I give ideas as well.
So it depends on the brand. So for you, was like, pick like some of your most favorite brands you worked with, get them all on Canva art, print them off. So we have them for your shoot. And then I told you to like, make sure you print a lot because we're just going to need a lot.
And then the second meeting is checking in on you like, Hey, what is going on? Do we need to push your shoe? Are you feeling overwhelmed? So it's like more of a mental check-in and like, what do we need to do to make sure you are ready for the shoot date? And I usually like to do that about two weeks beforehand. And then that's why I have so many meetings. So then when I go onto the shoot day, I already know what I'm doing. And if people have like pro video and content, I have like all those needs already listed out for people as well.
That's why people get so many pictures back to now if people would not do those meetings with me, I would tell them I've had only one client who did not.
And I was like, then you're gonna have to put together all the inspo board and you're gonna have to put together the timeline. They did, it worked out great. I probably could have got more if I would have known what was happening, but they were just too busy. So it worked out because they play in their own shoot.
Something I was really happy about was I could book hair and make-up through you, so it’s really a white-glove experience.
Ashley: Yes, yes. That's the other thing I remind people to. It's like the makeup artists that I recommend, they know exactly how I shoot because I've done their pictures so they know how to do the makeup. And also I gave you the tip of like, you need to tell them what you do and don't like. Because like, again, let's talk about the rescheduling part too. It's like, if you're not...
Like ready what there's no point to do the shoe like it's not a wedding day again Like it's not sometimes even engagement sessions. We just have to do it just to do it It's like it needs to be correct because a lot of people like this is a huge investment for them So if it's not ready so again like the makeup like tell them and that's again why I recommend the few people that I do Because they're not gonna have an ego about it. They're gonna be like, yeah, no, I get it Let me fix that for you because again, it needs to last for a very long time.
“I can tell you this story. I had one wonderful branding shoot. I loved everything about it, but she didn't tell me who she went and got her makeup done. She hated her makeup when she came to my studio. We did a 3-hour shoot. It was wonderful. I loved all of it. Her outfits, everything. And then I delivered the pictures. She’s like, “I hate my makeup.” I'm like, what? And she had to pay for a redo with me. Yeah. I did give her a discount just because I felt bad. But that's why I'm so involved because I hate it when that happens. I really do.”
So I remember sharing on social media about my photos after you'd sent me a sneak peek and I posted, if you're local to Kansas City, definitely reach out to Ashley. And you were like, ‘Actually I work with people everywhere. So reach out anyway.’ And I was like, wait a minute. I don't, I don't know if I like realized that. So tell us where you work with your clients, how you work with your clients, even if they don’t live in Kansas City.
“Yeah. So the majority of my clients actually don't even live in the Kansas City area. They live all over the United States and they find me through my aesthetic because of what my page looks like and it looks like what they're wanting.”
And then of course, ads too that I put out there, but I work with anybody and they sometimes do fly to me and we'll use like my studio or if there's a lot of things going on, a lot of models, things like that, we will go and run out a different studio that's in downtown, but there's lots of different ways to do it.
So I have this cookie company that I do a few shoots a year with we use the same two or three models every single time they pay them via Venmo I set up the whole shoot for them they mail me the cookies that I need to do they have their brand manager that actually works in Kansas City she comes on to this the shoe as well stylized everything I've only met this client one time.
Like she came one time because she just wanted to see what it was like. And other than that, I've never seen her again. We don't even do virtual calls. So people can do it like that where we have models that are their ideal client. have people who, yeah, again, just send me the products. I work with a purse company. do one or two shoots a year with them as well.
Or you can live in Kansas City. You can fly to Kansas City if you want to, or you can fly me someplace. Because if you think about it, it's the exact same amount of money. do you just might come into you if you have a space or you're going to come to me because you don't have a space because your product does not allow you to have like an actual warehouse or something. So lots of options. And that was one thing when I realized that I was like, so it's kind of like weddings, like you can do it anywhere. does not have to be based where you live.
And I think that's something that anybody who wants to be a photographer loves the weddings, but like you live in a small town, be a brand photographer because like you don't have to do it just in your small town. Like you can go and reach out people who have products in Texas and California and Wyoming, whatever it is, like they can just mail it to you.
So what does someone need to be ready to have a brand photoshoot done with you or with someone else?
Ashley: So I think the top three things is one, one inspo photo. I one inspo photo or I need some words to work off of, of like what you're trying to portray or who you're trying to attract and then from there I can build, I call them design decks with clients. I know that's different than what like you're actually doing, but then that way, like if they go over to a web designer.
It just keeps hearing this word design deck. So it just goes out seamlessly. It's really a mood board. This is what we're doing. Here's what your stock pictures will look like. Here's what your props will be.
And then the other thing is I honestly at least $2,000 like at least if it's your very first one because again, you're going to need a minimum of two hours and a lot of people now want the content as well. Whether that's iPhone video or they want to do the pro video pro videos great if you're really trying to reach like that next like luxury designer very like aesthetic client because that looks so good on your website.
Like so, so good. And the content's obviously like really good for social media, TikTok, things like that. That it's like quick and like get people's attention. So at least a minimum of $2,000 and then three, excitement. Like knowing like this is the next step of what to do for my business because my iPhone photos are not working, buying stock pictures are not working. So yeah, those would be the top three things, honestly.
to summarize:
To be ready for a brand photoshoot, you’ll need:
An inspiration photo or words to describe your brand
A budget, set aside $2000 for a 2+ hour shoot
Excitement - seeing the growth potential for your business
That's great. And you also offer pro video and iPhone video. So you are the complete package when it comes to someone who needs to revamp their marketing or website photos.
Ashley: Yes. Yep. then getting ready to launch in April, because now I'm having a problem with clients is like, but what do I do with this now? After they're done with their website and I'm like, well, you can ask your website designer if you want to if they do social media, which is hit or miss. I'm like, but now they're like, but I don't know what to do. I'm like, I can't do Canva or I can't do this. I'm like, okay.
“So we'll be opening up a social media business soon to help people use their photos and get the most value from them.”
And I have a family member who does social media working under that company for me. So then I'll just transition the brand clients over there and they're like, okay, thank you. This makes so much more sense now. Cause again, they're excited. It's like, what do I do? Like, I was like, okay, don't worry. I got you baby bird. Like, let me help you.
Opening up that side of your business for continual support is so nice. Cause then they have like a trusted brand partner. And for you, that's awesome that they have that with the social media side. I think that's so smart.
Ashley: Yes, and be clear. I do not make their brand. will not pick their colors. I will not pick their fonts. I need to go find something like you. And that's one thing people don't understand. Like you can't just have the branding shoot. You can't just do the website design. You can't just pick the person who runs your social media. Like you need all three and then to figure and that's the and I feel bad for businesses to be honest.
Like people just don't know that. I don't think it's talked about enough like. You really truly need all three or else it's just not going to work. And sometimes even the fourth, like the additional marketing team who's going to run the Instagram ads, the Google ads, unless I won't do that. again, I was like, I will give you authority figure on social media. I will make your grid so pretty. I will make you aesthetically pleasing. But yeah, it could be a fourth thing too, where you need somebody to specifically run ads for you, depending on what your business is.
Yeah, exactly. Ashley, this has been so great. And if you can just share where people can find you, learn more about you, and also learn about your upcoming launch for the social media stuff, that would be great.
Ashley: Yes, so I'm on Instagram as Ashleyice.branding. You will find some other Ashleyice accounts. Those are also mine because I like to have everything very organized and all the different aspects of my photography business. And then of course, right now for my branding page is Ashleyice.com for the website. I just have that all integrated together at the current moment.
So awesome, thank you for being here today Ashley.
Ashley: Yes, thank you.
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Ashley Ice is the brand photographer behind all the beautiful new photos on my website and I’m so excited to have her on the show. She shares how to get photos you are obsessed with, the difference between headshots and a brand photoshoot; we talk about how she works with her clients, what makes her process different, the 3 things you need to be ready for your own brand photoshoot and much more. If you need to update your photos, you’re thinking of refreshing your images for your marketing or website, this is the episode for you.